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Post 08 May 2011, 10:59 am

I'm in the process of taking one last look through some of the old Redscape threads, since I imagine Chad might decide he needs to pull the plug on it at some point soon. There was one thread over there that I thought was uniquely worth C&Ping over to the new site, which was a History forum thread where some of the original (join date in 2000) Redscapers recalled the origins of the site. I haven't copied everything from that discussion, as things drifted a bit from the subject of how the site got rolling. Below are the excerpts from that thread:

GMTom wrote:I'm not quite an original member.
I joined about 3 -6 months after Redscapes inception. The site was waaaaay different back then but it was similar as well, the site had several games all with maps posted, at that time I don't know if there was anything like it, at least I could fine nothing else (and I hunted a lot) .

Also similar was what seemed like a well established core of players that seemed to love to talk and talk. To be honest, I was simply a fly on the wall for a few weeks before registering and before making my first post. It seemed like they all knew each other so well, heck, who was I to jump into their discussions?

I did obviously jump in (look at my post total) and they welcomed me as a friend. That;s what i really like about redscape is the friendly nature of the site, everyone is welcome.

Riaz wrote:I tend to agree with Tom about the quality people on Redscape. You can have all the best players in the world, but, without good people, a gaming site cannot be successful. Thats probably what makes Redscape so great, I've never met a player in real life that I didn't like. I hope to one day meet every person I've played a game with, yes, even YOU Pawnmaker Wink

I think I fall into a similar category as Tom in terms of signup time, though I lag way behind in terms of service done to Redscape and the game of diplomacy.

As for memorable and infamous players, how can you make a list and not have Uhtar on it? Thats about as infamous as you can get!

geojanes wrote:Member 272 here.

The discussion boards have changed somewhat over the years. There were fewer categories, and I believe that more people participated (as a percentage of the total). The discussion on these forums after 9/11 was memorable, historic in fact. I wished they had been saved.

Ridculously Randy was one of the reasons the forums were so active. He was an articulate, affable, conspiracy theorist nutcase. He was equally sure to provoke laughter (chemtrails, anyone?) or outrage (promotion of the Protocols of the Elders of Zion, and that no Jews died in the attacks of 9/11), and occasionally provide a link or an idea that had a kernal of wisdom.

While there was at least one time I would have kicked his ass if he was in front of me, I miss his wacky perspective.

From a gaming standpoint, it's too bad Uhtar doesn't play anymore. His record was something like 8 solos in 9 games. It was amazing the quality of play here when I first joined. I learned sooo much in those first couple of games, and as a FtFer who only first played on-line here, I came to appreciate that Diplomacy is probably better played on-line than FtF. At the very least, they are different games.

I wish Redscape magazine had caught on. I think there is a place for more designed conent, rather than ad hoc discussions. The first issue was great, and it would be great if someone tried it again.

Memorable games include: Christine taking a one center austria and bringing it to 14 centers before time expired (I forget the game name, but I watched it, it was amazing).

Blod Bad had one season where 11 supply centers changed hands

But there are a ton of others that were worthly of further analysis.

GMTom wrote:Andy and barry were original members who are still with us.
I also remember Stuart (a very young kid of maybe 12 at the time) and Brian (a college professor from North Carolina) from way back who are no longer around. One other I miss (not an original but a long timer) is PMTed, he started the NWO game working from my original WW4 map and a bit of input. I took it over from him, made several changes working closely together and then, baaam, he dropped out of sight. That was years and years ago.

Sir Daffyd of Carmarthen wrote:Member #32 Checking in.

Still alive and kicking. What's that quote, "rumours of my death have been greatly exaggerated" or something like that.

I am not currently playing in any games but I might jump back in soon. Redscape is a good environment. Lot's of entertainment and there is also a good variety in games. I have had my issues posted with some variants types but the bottom line is if you don't like a particular Diplomacy game structure then don't play and just wait for the type that appeals to you. That is one of the good things about this site. And people are people, (some incredible, some to avoid, and most are decent) same as everywhere else. I do appreciate the quality of this site however.

As for slappy's query:

My candidate for greatest redscape citizen would be Keith Bailey. Perhaps not as active of some of the others but a quality guy and long standing veteran.

Infamous characters: whoever stabbed you last. I might be fairly infamous on a few peoples lists I suppose, but I think most people who have been around a while on the site have their friends and foes.

Memorable moments: I'll have to take the 5th on my own memorable moments on Redscape as you never know when you may want to reuse some of those strategies. I can say that when you plan comes together in diplomacy is really gives you some satisfaction (at least for me anyway). Some is by chance, but an awful lot is through effort. You reap what you sow type of thing. Some see LUCK, some see Labour Under Correct Unknowledge. That is, those that work strategically often are rewarded with good luck. I think that theory can apply to a lot of things, with the understanding that often does not mean always.

Lot's of memorable characters have seemed to have come and gone. Rediculously Randy was one for sure. It has also been interesting seening some others go from diplomacy neophytes to really good players. Perhaps they may not have had any direct dealings with me through match play but I have done a fair amount of watching from the sidelines in games I have not been involved in. You also see players change in tastes as well as Minister X has noted.

GMChad wrote:We experimented with a Redscape Magazine for awhile, but it ran aground after three issues. Anyways, here's a recap of the online interview Baron Ollie had with me about the founding of Redscape.



Baron Ollie


We all know what Redscape is today. Over 2000 of us frequent this site, play games, and participate in an online community that is second to none. But how did it all get started, and who is this guy who runs the place? Here is an introduction to the Diplomatic Corps' Don Miller Award winner for 2002, for Meritorious Service to the Diplomacy Hobby, and the site we have all grown to know and love.

How did you get started in Diplomacy?

Growing up, I had few friends who enjoyed playing boardgames; rarely could I coax someone into playing a game of Stratego, Axis & Allies, or chess. Myself, I was fascinated with games - particularly military simulations - and was greatly intrigued with boardgame design. I remember buying Diplomacy especially because it was a strategy war game NOT reliant on die-rolls for conflict resolution (something I loathed from playing Axis & Allies and Risk). I read through the rules, but as expected, never found the opportunity to play the game. The game went into storage and remained there undisturbed for nearly two years.

What gave you the idea for Redscape?

A friend of mine started dabbling in web design, and that inspired my own curiosity. Originally I created a website devoted to my interest in science fiction, but there was little content to distinguish my site from others or provide much interest to viewers. While searching for website inspiration, I stumbled upon my copy of Diplomacy resting dormant on my closet shelf and wondered if I could find and assemble six other "lost souls" online to finally play the game.

As luck would have it, the Avalon Hill website had a message board for people (like me) looking to find email opponents for various "grognard" boardgames; Diplomacy included. Jackpot! I contacted a few people and quickly found my way into a PBEM game as a replacement Austria. Alas, I played all of one turn before the game was cancelled due to sufficient lack of interest. Not to be deterred, I offered to take over as GM of a new game and invited the remaining players to join. I had a few accept, one of whom was the GM, Pete Chace (who soon proved instrumental in getting Redscape started). I went back to the Avalon Hill message board and succeeded in drumming up enough players for a new game. One of the players who accepted was Andy Baker (GMAndy).

What does Redscape mean?

"Redscape" is the title of a short story I wrote for a Creative Writing course in college. My story was profoundly inspired by my childhood reading of Bradbury's "The Martian Chronicles": where Mars was depicted as a warm, desert planet laden with mysteries.

I decided the title would likewise make for a good website (domain) name, as the name's ambiguity would lend well to any sort of creative content I wanted to cover, be it science fiction, artwork, storytelling, or gaming.

Sounds like interesting reading. Care to release it to us for inclusion in a future issue?

Although I wrote the story for a Creative Writing class, I envisioned the story best as a short animation work. Regardless, I've been meaning to get some more writing done and I want to polish the story slightly, but I would like to include it in a future Redscape magazine issue.

How did Redscape begin?

Although I was hosting a game of Diplomacy, I still wasn't playing a game of Diplomacy. Pete Chace soon offered to host a game and I was able at last able to play the game. With these two games running, it was easy to see something was missing with playing strictly over email; notably, players couldn't observe each other's games or fraternize with one another. Itching to do something with my idle webspace, I designed a site where players could choose a game from a main menu and then browse the map, results, center counts, and press statements for that game. At that time, all the webpages had to be manually created and uploaded by me and Pete Chace, but from a player's viewpoint, it looked like a Diplomacy game interface.

What happened then? How did it become a community beyond the buddies you had in those first two games?

I wish I had been keeping a journal of how the site matured! The best I can remember, it was a combination of word of mouth and having Redscape added to the Diplomacy web ring to attract new players, along with the inception volunteer GMs being first-rate - GMAndy, GMBaj, GMKib, GMTom, King in Yellow, Brian Tanner and Pete Chace - to name just a few. Even to this day, I still haven't done any advertising beyond search engine listing, partly in order to keep my workload manageable.

Has everything gone according to plan?

Definitely not. The first attempt (with Gary Pennington) at producing an automated Diplomacy program, Webjudge, started off like a dream come true, but soon fizzled out. In retrospect, some of the blame for that is mine, as I didn't formalize a design document and several times Gary had to undo hours of coding work to accommodate changes. However, this project was caught up in the "tech bust", and Gary's position with Sun Microsystems came into jeopardy and he had to put in overtime at his job just to stay employed. The overtime, and family responsibilities, sounded the death knell for the first WebJudge attempt.

What happened to Gary anyway?

I have no idea. I contacted him a few times but never heard back from him.

Have there been any surprises along the way?

That this site is still going - and growing! - is still the most wonderful surprise I experience every day.

How is the Webjudge coming?

The new WebJudge work will begin in June, with a new programmer this time, David Psurny. The plan is to use the already-scripted Ken Lowe judge code as the Diplomacy adjudicator and house the user features in a separate shell. This shell can then communicate with any game adjudicator, not just Diplomacy, and the forum scripting. This will allow players to access and utilize their personal settings wherever they are on the website.

Our estimated completion time for the WebJudge is December, 2002. Testing will probably begin around October.

Do you have anything like a development timeline for Redscape?

No definite timeline, other than the WebJudge to be fully operational by December. The completion of the WebJudge will mark the beginning of Redscape v2.0.

Aside from the Webjudge, can you give us a taste of any other upcoming changes in the works?

Definitely the main site pages covering the RHR (Redscape House Rules) need to be completed and the launch of the Redscape magazine is an obvious addition (thanks Shane!). Aside from those details, the goal is to continue broadening the site to encompass all strategy boardgames.

What does it REALLY cost in terms of time and money to keep a site like this up and running?

Present costs are $150/month. That pays for a dedicated server and decent bandwidth. I originally upgraded to a dedicated server in anticipation of the first WebJudge. A dedicated server isn't necessary to operate the forums, but it is teaching me how to operate one (in anticipation of the next WebJudge).

Time on the other hand is another matter. It goes without saying there is no way I could run the site without the Redscape and volunteer GMs assisting me. Daily administration and maintenance for me requires around 1-2 hours a day. It is finding the time for writing, designing, and programming additional pages for the site that eludes me.

What do you envision Redscape's place in the Diplomacy world to be?

Simply, the best place to play online Diplomacy!

I don't really expect the site to compete with compendium sites like the Diplomatic Pouch. Instead, the Redscape site is first and foremost about community. Having a place to play and socialize in a fun environment is what Redscape is all about!

What is your favorite power to play and why?

Truthfully, I don't have a favorite power. With all the site responsibilities, finding the time to think any more about Diplomacy by playing actual games could be hazardous to my health!


Thanks again, Chad for agreeing to the interview, and for Redscape. This is one heck of a site and getting better every day!

Machiavelli wrote:I actually wasn't an original member of Redscape, but showed up shortly after it was launched (for Game #7, a fleet Rome variant called "Hornblower," which was run by Brian Tanner). Uhtar trashed me in that game (which was also his first) by sticking a knife into my 11 center Austria with his 10 center Prussia. I haven't been able to get comfortable in an alliance since. GMTom arrived for the next game, ("Harbinger"). Here before me were GMAndy (whom I haven't heard from in a month of Sundays and Colin Bilasky.

Chad can correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe Redscape got started in early 1999. The first iteration I saw was a black-bordered title screen with the Dip logo in the middle that clicked through to a black-backgrounded screen with, I think, map thumbnails from ongoing games. There were never more than 8 or so games running at a time, so that format worked pretty well. It also had some sort of bulletin board function, but as I recall the threads were only sorted chronologically, so you never knew what you'd find.

As I recall, the (more-or-less) current site launched on February 11th or 12th of 2000, and I was among the first dozen or so to sign up, but there was some technical issue that caused those first sign-ups to be wiped. My wife's birthday falls on the 16th, and I think we took a romantic weekend, so I didn't get back to re-register until the 17th, dropping me all the way to member #39.

An interesting and entertaining ride it's been. Chad deserves major kudos for putting it all together (actually, he deserves more than kudos, I'm gonna drop him a long overdue "paypal" tip). I rarely have time to play Dip anymore, but the constant development of the discussion forums (which Randy certainly helped midwife, but which really owe their existence to the Clinton/Lewinsky/impeachment affair) continues to fascinate.

GMChad wrote:I registered the Redscape domain name on November 1st, 1997. However, I don't believe the site was geared up for (Diplomacy) gaming until October 1998.

GMTom wrote:Barry is close to nailing many points but he was here before me and Harbinger was not my first game. I joined in the very early stages of Redscape, I think it was in February-March time frame of 1999. I actually was following the site for a month or two before registering so dang, I'm even earlier than I thought.

At that time the site was sooooo small, I felt like an outsider to this small group of players. They all knew each other so well, I felt like I might not be welcome... I was wrong! Our bigger size helps make people feel welcome a bit more I hope? A small group of say 50 people is more "daunting" than one of several thousand!

Junkoman wrote:I was a mere lad of 16 when I joined this site for my first game of online diplomacy. I must be an anti-Uhtar. My survival record isn't even as good as his solo record.

King In Yellow wrote:I started playing here in August of 1998. I remember Machiavelli, GMAndy and GMKib and GMWill and of course Chad from the very early days. Tamerlane and PMTed were around very ealy as well. Not sure when Muad Dib started in, but it was pretty early as well.

I believe my first game was entitled Game 3 (yes games used to be numbered).

Great place to play all games, I must admit I have made some very good friends here, though I generally don't play Diplomacy anymore.


Andy wrote:As Scott mentioned, Game 3 began in August 1998. Chad contacted me in July (as he mentioned, Avalon Hill maintained a list of people interested in playing games via email) but I told him that I couldn't play because I was going on vacation. He contacted me after my vacation to tell me that there was an opening, so I joined the game. Game 4 opened one or two months later and I joined that game, too. A few months later, Chad asked me if I would GM a game and I agreed. I GM'd a number of Diplomacy games during the next few years (never more than two at one time) and then switched to Advanced Civilization. Lately, I have been very busy with other activities, so I am only involved with the annual Patriot Games tournament.

der Blaue Reiter wrote:I only get a chance to browse the forums irregularly now, but for awhile there I was a relatively significant contributor.
Great to re-read all these thoughts tonight.

As for Slappy's original post, I'm definitely up for a rejuvenated book club--Jeff (McBeth) knows where to find me if I don't reply to forum invites. Clued me in to some great works.

Great moments in dipping, I suppose I'll toot my own horn with a bit of self-consciousness, only because I know no one else will and people occasionally ask about this kind of event. I believe I was the first to be part of a round-the-map convoy: PG2, I was Italy, Corruptone was Turkey, we got my A STP-Syria just as I scored my 18th center for the win.

Other than that my most memorable game would have to be Olympians. On that note the one guy that gets my competitive drive going the most (when I'm not working with him Smile ) is Frost. With Uhtar I can still be laughing with multiple knives protruding out of my chest...but alas he's sworn off this silly thing.
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Joined: 07 Mar 2005, 9:12 am

Post 08 May 2011, 11:00 am

Here are some quotes from members who joined between the start of 2001 and the end of 2002. I realize I'm wrecking the continuity of some back-and-forth remarks from the old thread by separating the posts according to join year of the poster. Sue me. :) I never intended to copy the entire thread...

Rewind wrote:I think GM Tom, Machiavelli, Santana, GM Andy and GM Kib are amoung the original players on this site that are still active. Chad is indeed the creator and administrator.

I'd be interested in hearing the story of Redscape as well if one of these guys wants to fill us in. Smile

We used to have numbers under our usernames that related to when you signed up. I was #490 to sign up, so I missed out on the first year or two of Redscape.

Roadkill315 wrote:Being Member #: 1825 myself (I thought I used to be 1713 or 1790?), I cannot add any thoughts on that first day of redscape... But I believe fourteen redscapers share the very oldest 'Joined Date' of Feb.13 2000. Of those I recognize only two names and see only one posting still with any regularity.

McBeth wrote:I had forgotten about RR.

Hmm, looks like I'm 1824. Well, not as good as my /. number, but respectable Smile

I came here looking for Advanced Civilization gaming, and have yet to be disappointed.

Rewind wrote:Ridculously Randy! Yeah, I miss him too. He made for some lively discussions about UFOs, Chem-trails, and the like.

The Redscape Magazine was lots of fun to read too. I especially liked the "Albert" column.

Minister X wrote:If I recall correctly, when I first signed up I paid little or no attention to the discussion forums. Then I began to see some of the stuff Randy was posting and that got me angry and I began posting. Now I no longer play or GM (or even fiddle much with variants), and am active only in the discussion forums.

Minister X wrote:I'm the one who has to plead "guilty" to The Monkey Cage, though Steve was quite complicit. Though it was controversial at the time, some of us were bothered by the extent of trolling. Chad allowed me to run a game called "The Monkey Cage" and thus get control of a game forum. As moderator of that forum (maybe Steve was co-moderator), I could control who was allowed to post there and I could edit/delete any/all posts. Chad understood that I wanted the forum to stay up even after the game being played there was over. I then invited a number of Redscapers to join either the game and/or the planned discussion group.

The members were (according to the mailing list I've never deleted): Tom Mulledy, Tamerlane, Steve, Sofuzz, Robert Wells, Prince Scribe, Persona non Grata, PCHiway, Machievelli, Jonathan Fried, James Watson, Gremlinkitty, George Janes, Brian Niebrugge, Bluesman, Baron Ollie, and myself. This may be the initial list or the final one; I'm not sure. Maybe somewhere in between. I tried to get participants from across a wide swathe of the political spectrum but was accused of pro-conservative bias.

We had some good discussions and anyone at Redscape could read them but only the exclusive clubbers could post. I received a number of requests from readers asking to be included in the group and was relatively strict in my decision-making, accepting some and rejecting more than a few. These rejections made me several enemies and caused some controversy, and I soon relinquished control of the forum to a committee. But controversy regarding our exclusivity continued and we soon became much less active. An improving tone of discourse at Redscape generally also contributed to the decline of The Cage. Chad kept the forum up for a good while, but then deleted in during one of the periodic cleansings of old game forums, and so the content of the discussions disappeared.

We did have some rather obnoxious trolls back then. Several efforts were made at different times to tame them or drive them away and those efforts, which were almost always ad hoc and unorganized, expressing merely the "sense of the community", were always successful sooner or later. The Monkey Cage was conceived at a time when such informal efforts weren't working too quickly. Despite the controversy generated, I think The Cage did set a good example of adult behavior and sophisticated online debating.

Redscape is a MUCH more pleasant environment for in-depth discussions like those we have than anyplace else I've seen. The Monkey Cage was merely one very small part of the reason that's so. Much more important is the sort of self-policing that goes on regularly: calling out posters who employ questionable tactics and showing extremely low tolerance for trolls and other such animals. I think that the constant example of adult posting set here naturally discourages 90% of rude/childish behavior. The remaining 10% (or less) is handled as it comes up.

I think what we've accomplished in that regard is quite admirable. At the moment we're extraordinarily troll-free but I think it would be imprudent to let our vigilance slide or let our standards fall. Only by retaining an institutional memory of troll-handling and similar tactics, and by making every effort to maintain very high standards, can we preserve Redscape discussion forums as an island of sanity in the internet's sea of sludge.

There is of course a fine line between "enforcing" etiquette and limiting free speech. I think we've navigated that gray area quite well. We very rarely if ever censure content, only methods of expression. Even vaguely ad hominem attacks get labeled as such, and perpetrators get chastised, but logical discussion of any substantive points made by that poster continue.

As in any discussion, things sometimes get a bit out of hand. Sometimes two or more posters get into it in an overheated manner. But before long the gentle comments from others creep in, reminding them that they're doing their causes a disservice and damaging their credibility. It works.

I credit Chad for employing the bad-language filter and support him fully in that decision desite being an inveterate employer of earthy language whenever possible in my non-Redscape life. Sure, it's silly to see so many references to $@#! Cheney, but overall the filter contributes to the relatively elevated tone of conversations here.

McBeth wrote:The book club was great fun, I read all sorts of good things. The biggest problem was that people weren't reading the books. I'll participate any time.

SuperAnt wrote:Ya know, I just thought of seemed to me back when I joined in Sept, 2001, that there was a significant age gap in the players. There were youngin's like me (I was 16 when I joined as well), and old farts like.....well, I'm not going to answer that Razz

Since many of the "youngins" now have grown up a bit and we have a number of us in our early to mid-20's, and keeping in mind more youngins join this site, I wonder if the whole age distribution of Redscape has changed significantly or not.

Reuben wrote:Nuts, it's a shame that you've lost the early stuff Chad.

At university, one of my projects was to put together a CD-ROM interactive guide. I chose to create a GM guide, which was designed to act as an appendix to the Redscape site. The project is either lost or buried in a box somewhere back at my mom's flat in Australia. She's visiting with me in Canada right now, so when she goes home I'll ask her to send me my school stuff. It borrowed graphically from Redscape, so there might be some interesting stuff.

I'm surprised that no-one's called up the 'wayback machine' yet.

This is what I found there after some digging. It works better if you can remember the site url heirarchies, which I don't...

Link 1
Link 2
Link 3 (whoohoo)
Link 4 (now we're getting somewhere...)
Link 5
Link 6 (note the nice little graphics (at the bottom) for posting new topics and replies)
Link 7

Reuben wrote:And more:

Link 8 (I like that top graphic)
Link 9

I'm gettin sleepy, but it was fun while it lasted...

Amyrlin wrote:Wow... that first link took me on a trip down memory lane... my first game, First Time Diplomats, was in the games section! At the time I was playing Diplomacy during my spare time in computer programming class in the 8th grade. Now I've graduated high school and am going to the University of Florida in the fall... how quickly life goes by...

I remember back when Crazy J was the only diehard libertarian on the board; his good reasoning helped me to move from kinda-sorta-liberal to really libertarian. Then Vince showed up - his screen name was TheForeignMinister at that time - and Crazy J and I contributed to his turning to the libertarian side as well.

Ah, memories...

Reuben wrote:What was weirdest for me was realising that years like 2001 and 2002 were a fair whack of time ago. Internet years I thought at first. But then when I think back to what I was doing then, like Amyrlin, it seems like AGEEEES ago.


ForsakenDeity wrote:I joined Redscape right after I discovered Diplomacy in 8th grade. It is kinda sentimental to me now that I'm about to leave for college in the fall. I think I was something like member #1200. I'm up for the book club again, it was fantastic.

Doctor Fate wrote:Strangely enough, I'd been looking for something like Redscape and was convinced it didn't exist. I'd played (maybe) two games by email and the Los Angeles hobby had gone into a coma. I was not too proficient at googling and could not find a site that looked like "home." I think (not sure) it was via the Diplomatic Pouch. Even then, it took a while for me to figure out how to sign up and then get into a game.

I'd just graduated from grad school and was trying to kill a few minutes at work--and there it was: Redscape! I managed to win my first game (GM'd by the illustrious Dr. Jack Jennings--a great guy keeping a low profile these days) and was hooked. Come to think of it, I think the Great Pintoski GM'd my second game and I won that one too.

Like Minister X, I was unaware of the other forums. I guess, basically, you could say I had no idea what a site could really be like. I was an Internet newbie.

I suppose the highest compliment I can pay Redscape (and therefore, naturally, Chad) is that I've recommended the site to numerous folks. It's simply the best place to play that I can imagine.

I don't hang out in the political forum as much as I used to--mostly because it finally dawned on me that virtually no one has an open mind in those discussions, including me. The new wave of ultra-libertarians took any/all joy right out of it.

The Monkey Cage was MX's baby--and it definitely served its purpose. Trolling was at an all-time low. I was just along for the ride. He is self-effacing, a nice guy, and he has enormous integrity. I'm not ready to put him on Mt. Rushmore--well, maybe if there's a Redscape-only version.

On a personal note, I understand completely MX's decision to no longer GM. And, even though I get it and identify with him, it's a shame. It is a shame that players do not treat volunteer GM's like they're doing them (the players) a favor. Newsflash: They are doing you a favor! GM'ing can be fun--when players send in clear orders on time. Sadly, that doesn't always happen. Even when it does, rules disputes that ought to be handled civilly and privately can become public debates--and in every case I've ever seen, it was not the GM who started the fight. I don't get that. It's a game. Some of the GM's, and MX was top-flight, knock themselves out with maps, graphics, everything but theme music (frankly, if it was technically possible, I'm sure MX would have done that too). But, a minority of players, because they lose sight of the fact that this is, when all is said and done, a game, damage the entire community by driving GM's from continuing to want to serve.

So, what's the damage? It's simple: players show up on Redscape and can't find a game. Gee, why would that be? One answer is because several guys (and maybe a few girls too) have given up GM'ing because they can have more fun walking the highway and dodging in and out of traffic.

I don't mean to throw water on the whole thing. 95% of the players are great (people, if not players). But, that 5% (probably less) can put a damper on it for everyone. When an excellent, creative, and funny GM decides, or rather is led to conclude by ridiculous actions and comments of players that he/she is no longer willing/able to GM, we've all lost something. What we haven't lost is the player attitude that causes this in the first place. Imagine going to a restaurant, getting comp'd, and then going ballistic on the chef because your steak was medium instead of medium rare.

Here's a funny cop story, apropos of nothing, but not a hijack attempt:

I had a partner who started every shift by going to McDonald's because it was free (for cops). I could not/would not do that. He received his food one morning and went back to the register. "Excuse me. These pancakes are cold. Can I have another set?" I was pretty embarrassed--they were FREE! Of course, if they ever tried to charge him, he'd get the manager over. Thankfully, I worked with him for about 2 weeks. I'd never seen such a selfish, ungrateful action. Well, now, courtesy of the small percentage of bad eggs here, I have. That's sad.

Good thread. Sorry for the mini-rant, but some folks just don't get it. This is a great place, filled with people who volunteer their time and effort to provide enjoyment for others. Those who cannot appreciate and respect that, ought to at least have the decency not to lessen the community for others.

Dr. Jack Jennings wrote:What would be the odds that I receive a compliment on the preceding post and then show up….hehehe. Anyhow, I found the game in June 2002, I cannot believe that it is four years ago. I can't. I was working with 'Magnus' and he introduced it to me and I was hooked.

The last competive game I was in was the original tournament of scoundrels which I had to resign due to RL circumstances. I'm thinking of making a return, however, because the game is really so much fun and you just can't get the same level of enjoyment with other similar games.

My memory is uncharacteristically shoddy about certain games/events. I do remember one particularly painful stab at the hands of Riaz. But, my good buddy Magnus has informed me that retribution has been made…hehehe.

I'm hoping to get into PG7 and do well for a team and finally get that elusive victory that's avoided me for 4 years. It's nice to see that many of same people who were here four years ago are still here. Quite amazing really.

Baron Ollie wrote:BOO!

Ha ha! Good to see all the die-hards still haven't kicked it.

Some of you wondered about good old Ridiculously Randy... I just went to a CFL game with him a few weeks ago. He's still good stuff though he isn't quite as controversial as he used to be... or maybe I am more controversial... Wink

SLOTerp wrote:By the way, I still remember my 1st game. Vimy Ridge, hosted by Baron Ollie. Hard to believe that was over four years ago!
Last edited by Heck Tate on 08 May 2011, 11:20 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Post 08 May 2011, 11:00 am

I think there was only one bit of input from a post-2002 member.

Fascista wrote:Wow. Haven't logged in here in quite a while. I used to follow the political discussions, because they were fun. Stopped doing that maybe half a year, to a year ago, mostly because they stopped being so fun...

Haven't really been here since.

I think that's it. If anyone goes back to the old site (while it still exists) and notices a post from the original history thread that I should have included above, feel free to C&P it below yourself.

Obviously, if anyone else feels like adding his own reminiscences about the early days of (old) Redscape, or telling the story of how you found Redscape, feel free to add it below.
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Post 08 May 2011, 12:01 pm

GMTom wrote:
I also remember Stuart (a very young kid of maybe 12 at the time)

Probably wildly wrong, but I might be that Stuart. I've had a number of different usernames - kept changing my email address, and that meant re-registering. I think my first was General Grey, but also DPM. I vaguely remember playing a couple of games, one as colorado in NAFTA, may even have GM'ed a game. I've just tried to find my old account on the old site but only the first page of the membership list remains. But i think I first joined in 2001, because I remember I was playing as turkey when 9/11 happened.
I would have been 14 then.