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Post 18 Oct 2016, 10:27 am

I know how it is. I am saying how I want it to work. If you are out of country, you would need to go to the consulate, show ID and get it shipped to you. If you are out CONUS for military duty you would need to show ID and have it shipped then.

I agree that the rules as they are show possibility for fraud. Exactly why we need change.
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Post 19 Oct 2016, 10:48 am

https://ballotpedia.org/Voter_identification_laws_by_state

https://www.ncdot.gov/dmv/driver/id/

North Carolina doesn't charge for ID. Is that enough to meet your criteria of Free ID and States impinging on voting rights? As I recall you use NC for much of your argument of impingement. They provide Free ID.

I know... Probably still not enough.

Never is.
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Post 19 Oct 2016, 11:02 am

bbauska wrote:https://ballotpedia.org/Voter_identification_laws_by_state

https://www.ncdot.gov/dmv/driver/id/

North Carolina doesn't charge for ID. Is that enough to meet your criteria of Free ID and States impinging on voting rights? As I recall you use NC for much of your argument of impingement. They provide Free ID.

I know... Probably still not enough.

Never is.

I use NC because it was where a recent voting law was struck down as Unconstitutional.
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Post 19 Oct 2016, 11:06 am

bbauska wrote:I know how it is. I am saying how I want it to work. If you are out of country, you would need to go to the consulate, show ID and get it shipped to you. If you are out CONUS for military duty you would need to show ID and have it shipped then.
Fine for people out of the country. But there are genuine reasons for absentee and/or early voting, too.

I agree that the rules as they are show possibility for fraud. Exactly why we need change.
But you never said that about absentee voting.
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Post 19 Oct 2016, 11:28 am

As long as ID is shown with Absentee or in person, I don't care.

No comment from you regarding the NC case where you claim impingement has occurred, and there is free ID. I gave you both requirements for you that you asked for.

Is that enough for you to say there is little reason to stand in the way of ID being required to vote?
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Post 20 Oct 2016, 8:19 am

bbauska wrote:As long as ID is shown with Absentee or in person, I don't care.

No comment from you regarding the NC case where you claim impingement has occurred, and there is free ID. I gave you both requirements for you that you asked for.

Is that enough for you to say there is little reason to stand in the way of ID being required to vote?

How would ID work for absentee voting? Who do you show you ID to when filling in your vote?

No comments because the law that was struck down were mainly about other aspects of voting, such as restrictions on early voting. If ID is indeed free and easy to obtain, then that is that. But ID requirements ate not a panacea against fraud, and indeed may provide false security.
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Post 20 Oct 2016, 8:28 am

I agree that the system is not perfect, but showing ID will help.

As for the Absentee ballot, I gave some ID Requirements in an earlier posting.

Showing acceptable ID to another acceptable location, such as consulate, military voting officer, county elections office in another state could certainly help.
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Post 20 Oct 2016, 1:55 pm

bbauska wrote:I agree that the system is not perfect, but showing ID will help.

As for the Absentee ballot, I gave some ID Requirements in an earlier posting.

Showing acceptable ID to another acceptable location, such as consulate, military voting officer, county elections office in another state could certainly help.

Did you know a lot of people who use absentee ballots do so because they are housebound? How do they get to the elections office?

As for consulates and embassies, have you seen the queues at Grosvenor Square on a normal day? They seriously would not be able to cope with US citizens residents in England, even with the consulates in NI, Scotland and Wales to cover the rest of the UK.
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Post 20 Oct 2016, 4:22 pm

If it is important enough to vote, then people have to make the needed effort to get everything in order.

Family, church, community organizers et al. can help.
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Post 21 Oct 2016, 5:27 am

bbauska wrote:If it is important enough to vote, then people have to make the needed effort to get everything in order.

Family, church, community organizers et al. can help.
How does that answer the question? If someone is housebound, who do they show their ID to, to get their vote? "Family, church, community organisers et al" presumably are not agents of the election board. So are they OK to check the ID, or do you need polling agents to go to the house, or what?
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Post 21 Oct 2016, 7:50 am

Danivon, you seem to come up with small and minor numerical portions of the society to disallow what could be a good idea. All in the name of equality.

Then, when I show that everyone should be treated equally (no special treatment for any race, preferential treatment for jobs or college. et. al.) you want inequality.

What percentage of people are so housebound, that they never leave the house for church, groceries, medical or anything. I would venture a guess it is less than 1/10 of 1 percent. The question is how to solve it while maintaining the equality of a requirement to show valid ID. I am fine with the family, friends, and religious leaders helping. Lets hear some of your wisdom on how to solve the issue.
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Post 21 Oct 2016, 8:01 am

bbauska wrote:Danivon, you seem to come up with small and minor numerical portions of the society to disallow what could be a good idea. All in the name of equality.

Then, when I show that everyone should be treated equally (no special treatment for any race, preferential treatment for jobs or college. et. al.) you want inequality.

What percentage of people are so housebound, that they never leave the house for church, groceries, medical or anything. I would venture a guess it is less than 1/10 of 1 percent. The question is how to solve it while maintaining the equality of a requirement to show valid ID. I am fine with the family, friends, and religious leaders helping. Lets hear some of your wisdom on how to solve the issue.
Indeed that is the question. What is the answer?

My answer is to not require ID from people to get an absentee ballot, and rather to improve checks - the case I cited above was only found two years later, whereas a check straight after the polls closed of whether a voter was actually alive would have found it sooner.

And do not give me this "inequality" guff. It's self evident that someone who is physically unable to get to the polling station would either need an absentee ballot, or would not be able to vote. The equality you want is to have a new hurdle that ALL must jump in order to vote, knowing that some people can't jump it (but dismissing them as a small number). On the other hand, what about the equality of being able to just vote, as per the rights of a citizen?

Now, you want ID to be mandatory even for the housebound who want an absentee ballot. How do you do it? Do you have paid election officials go around to check their ID?
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Post 21 Oct 2016, 8:19 am

Why is it the right to vote must have zero strings attached? Yet the right to bear arms requires "strings" such as background checks? Seems to me liberals have some difficult explaining to do?
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Post 21 Oct 2016, 8:35 am

GMTom wrote:Why is it the right to vote must have zero strings attached? Yet the right to bear arms requires "strings" such as background checks? Seems to me liberals have some difficult explaining to do?


I brought that up before, and I agree with you.
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Post 21 Oct 2016, 8:40 am

danivon wrote:Now, you want ID to be mandatory even for the housebound who want an absentee ballot. How do you do it? Do you have paid election officials go around to check their ID?


Sounds fine to me, only for those who need special treatment. I voted absentee for 20 years. I needed to show ID to the voting officer to send with the request for ballot. I suppose that is too hard, and I should have a right to gripe about the disparate treatment.

I am so downtrodden.

Help, help, I 'm being repressed!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l8ukak8P2vY