freeman3 wrote:Looks like she is going to be executed. In general, I am against the death penalty because it is an ugly, cold-blooded process, state-sanctioned homicide even if there is just cause for it. In many cases, defendants deserve death but the process makes it not worth it IMHO. In Gissendaner's case--a woman, who did not actually do the murder but orchestrated it, and two delays of the execution-- it is particularly awful.

http://mobile.nytimes.com/2015/09/30/us ... oogle.com/

Gissendaner was convicted in 1998 of recruiting her lover to kill her husband, Doug Gissendaner, 30. Her boyfriend, Gregory Owen, testified against her as part of a plea bargain that landed him a life sentence but spared him from the death penalty.

Prosecutors said Gissendaner, a mother of three from Auburn, wanted her husband dead so she could profit from two $10,000 life insurance policies and the couple's $84,000 house.

She dropped off Owen at her Auburn house before going out with friends on Feb. 7, 1997. Owen surprised 30-year-old Doug Gissendaner and forced him at knifepoint to drive to a remote area in eastern Gwinnett near the Walton County line.

Owen forced the victim to walk 100 yards into the woods and get down on his knees. He beat him in the head with a nightstick, stabbed him in the neck and back several times and left. The wife later helped her boyfriend set the car on fire to destroy evidence.

The Georgia Supreme Court upheld Gissendaner's murder conviction and death sentence in July 2000.

freeman3 wrote:Appeals are not the whole process. It's everything involved in the state cold-bloodedly putting someone to death. Even if she opted not to appeal it wouldn't change my views on it. I didn't see where she was offered a plea deal, but the person who did the murder got life . In my mind, it's not the issue of the defendant deserving it or not (maybe she did though there are a lot worse cases) but the state involvement in putting a person to death.

The man who carried out the murder, Gregory Owen, Ms. Gissendaner’s boyfriend, was sentenced to life imprisonment in a plea agreement. Ms. Gissendaner, who rejected an offer to plead guilty in exchange for a sentence of life imprisonment with the eventual possibility of parole, was convicted in 1998.

freeman3 wrote:We disagree. That's fine.

After a sweeping two-year review, the state Supreme Court outlawed capital punishment in Connecticut, saying Thursday that the state's death penalty no longer comports with evolved societal values and serves no valid purpose as punishment.

The 4-3 decision effectively removes 11 convicts from Connecticut's death row and overturns the latest iteration of the state's death penalty, a political compromise effective April 2012 that barred death sentences going forward but allowed the execution of inmates already sentenced.

William Petit, the sole survivor of the Cheshire home invasion, criticized the majority's decision. "The dissenting justices clearly state how the four members of the majority have disregarded keystones of our governmental structure such as the separation of powers and the role of judicial precedent to reach the decision they hand down today," Petit wrote. "The death penalty and its application is a highly charged topic with profound emotional impact, particularly on the victims and their loved ones. Justice Espinosa, in her dissent especially, forcefully and compassionately recognizes that devastating impact."

Cynthia Hawke-Renn, the sister of Jennifer Hawke-Petit, who was killed along with her two daughters, Hayley, 17, and Michaela, 11, said, "I never thought it would happen, that we would see them die, but I always thought that there should be a punishment that fits the crime."

"I don't think that will ever happen now in this case," she said.

According to Hayes' confession, the two men had planned to rob the house under cover of darkness and flee the scene with the family bound, but unharmed. Hayes attributed the outcome of the event to a change in their plan. Upon their arrival in the early hours of July 23, they found William Petit sleeping on a couch on the porch.[10] With a baseball bat that they had found in the yard, Komisarjevsky struck William on the head and then restrained him in the basement, at gunpoint. Following the restraining, the children and the mother were bound and locked in their respective rooms. Hayes says he and Komisarjevsky were not satisfied with their haul, and that a bankbook was found which had an available balance. Hayes convinced Jennifer to withdraw $15,000 from her line of credit when the bank opened.[1][11]

A gas station's video surveillance shows Hayes purchasing $10 worth of gasoline in two cans he had taken from the Petit home. After returning to the house, and unloading the gas, he took Jennifer to the bank. The prosecution later entered this as evidence of premeditated murder.[12] The defense entered arguments pertaining to the exact whereabouts of the containers, signaling foul play. The bank surveillance cameras captured the transaction which shows Jennifer Hawke-Petit in the morning of July 23 as she informed the teller of her situation. The bank manager then called 911 and reported the details to police while Jennifer was still at the teller. The manager reported to the 911 dispatcher, in real time, as Jennifer left the bank and was picked up by Hayes—describing his clothing as he drove away with Jennifer. The manager stated that Jennifer had indicated the assailants were "being nice", and she believed they only wanted money.

The Cheshire police response to the bank's "urgent bid" began with assessing the situation and setting up a vehicle perimeter.[13] The police used up more than half an hour taking these preliminary measures while the assailants were raping and murdering the females inside the house.[14] The police made no contact with the occupants of the house, making no effort to make the assailants aware of a police presence.[14]

During this time, Hayes and Komisarjevsky escalated the aggravated nature of their crimes: Komisarjevsky raped the 11-year-old Michaela.[15][16] Komisarjevsky, who had photographed the sexual assault of the youth on his cell phone,[17] then provoked Hayes to rape Jennifer. While Hayes was raping Jennifer on the floor of her living room, Komisarjevsky entered the room announcing that William Petit had escaped. Hayes then strangled Jennifer, doused her lifeless body and parts of the house including the daughters' rooms with gasoline. The daughters, while tied to their beds, had both been doused with gasoline; each had her head covered with a pillowcase.[18] A fire was then ignited, and Hayes and Komisarjevsky fled the scene. Hayley and Michaela both died from smoke inhalation.[19]

William Petit had been able to free himself, escape his confines, and call to a neighbor for help.[20] The neighbor indicated that he did not recognize Petit, due to the severity of Petit's injuries. In court testimony, William Petit stated that he felt a "jolt of adrenaline" coupled with a need to escape upon hearing one of the perpetrators state: "Don't worry, it's going to be all over in a couple of minutes." Petit then told the jury, "I thought, it's now or never because in my mind at that moment, I thought they were going to shoot all of us."[21]

Hayes and Komisarjevsky fled the scene using the Petit family car. They were immediately spotted by police surveillance, pursued by police, apprehended, and arrested one block away.[13] The whole invasion lasted seven hours.

Sassenach wrote:I grew up in a small town of about 5000 people where nothing interesting ever happens. Back in the early 70s we had a murder, which was major news of course and resulted in the conviction of a young man called Stephen Downing who had mental disabilities after he was subjected to highly questionable (and unlawful) interrogation tactics from the local police which initially resulted in a confession, which he later retracted. He then spent 27 years in prison fighting to have the conviction overturned. It was only the fact that his case was picked up by a local journalist who spent over a decade campaigning on his behalf that he eventually succeeded in getting his conviction quashed. The court ruled that there were gross improprieties in the way that the police had handled the investigation and ordered his immediate release. An innocent man had to spend 27 years in prison for a crime that he didn't commit, having been fitted up by the police.

Still, it could have been worse. It had only been 4 years earlier that Britain finally abolished the death penalty...

It's cases like this one which lead me to oppose capital punishment. Miscarriages of justice do occur a lot more regularly than we'd like. There's obviously no way that you can ever adequately compensate somebody for losing their life to unjust imprisonment. Downing was eventually paid £750000 in compo but that's hardly sufficient for the loss of his youth (he was 17 when he went to prison) and complete destruction of his life. He is still alive though, which is something. Execution is final.

I feel much more comfortable knowing that miscarriages of justice can still be rectified. I also tend to think that life imprisonment is sufficient punishment. The most famous serial killers in Britain, Ian Brady and Myra Hindley, have been serving life with no prospect of parole since 1966 and both have put in pleas asking to be put to death.

freeman3 wrote:One of the reasons I changed my view on capital punishment was the extremely low homicide rates in other advanced western countries. Getting the state out of administering death does not cause a homicide free-for-all. In fact, I suspect that as a society moves away from capital punishment homicide rates go down. In fact, we are seeing homicide rates in the US go down at the same time opposition to capital punishment grows. I don't know why that happens but there is something in the culture that lead both to opposition to capital punishment and lower homicide rates. They go hand-in-hand.

Sassenach wrote:It's not a question of whether or not they committed the crime Brad, I don't support capital punishment.

My point was that whilesoever you have a death penalty you'll end up with situations where innocent people get executed. It probably won't happen a lot, but once is one too many. The only way to prevent it from happening is to oppose capital punishment for everybody.

I also said that I don't really see life imprisonment as a soft option, or it needn't be. Certainly it isn't a deterrent.

bbauska wrote:Would Sass and Freeman NOT vote for a death penalty judgment on the Connecticut case?

What possibility is there that they did not do the crime? Please explain that rationale that they didn't rape and murder those three ladies.